So maybe there is proof that red meat and milk may be slightly ‘bad’ for you, but there is also proof that both have many benefits, insofar as human health, as well. Why is it that you can only find the proof that meat/milk are bad, but not the proof they they are good, too? Why can you only find the proof that that soy is good for you, but not that it has MAJOR jhealth risks associated with it? Didn’t you know that soy can cause brain damage and that, when fed to small boys, can act similar to hormone therapy due to the similarities between soy and estrogen? If you want to claim health reasons, then PLEASE do all of your research. Otherwise, you look like an idiot to the more well-informed people of the world.
I’m not telling you to change your dietary choices, just to realise that others may have information that makes them want to eat a more balanced diet that includes meat and dairy products. No one food is perfect. That’s why variety is the key.
I never said anyone should eat tons of meat or to eat so much saturated fat that it’s like eating a tub of Crisco. I’m saying that balencing your food choices is a good thing. Remember, eating an ounce of meat per day is still eating meat.
Also remember, I’m not advocating pumping meat full of chemicals and hormones any more than a Vegan would advocate coating their food in pesticides and eating it without washing it, at the very least. I never said, ‘We need to eat more chemicals’.
6 years ago
I know that soy is only one food popular with Vegans and Vegetarians. What I’m saying is that they tend to use only a few reports and ignore the rest. Read them ALL, then decide.
I know, some eat the way they do, not for health reasons, but for animal rights (the cruelty of the slaughterhouses). Some even assume that all I eat is McD’s burgers (blegh-no, just because I eat meat does not mean I eat at McD’s).
Mind you, my favorite meat to eat is venison…from wild deer, not farm animals. I’ll give them the quickest, most painless death I can…which is much better than prolonging their pain and is much better than the ultra-fatty meat sold in stores from farm-raised animals.
I don’t assume to know what each individual Vegan or Vegetarian puts on their plate every night. Don’t assume that I eat all my meals at McD’s. it only leaves you with a flawed arguement.
I asked why many of you think your diet is the ONLY way to eat healthy?
Red meat and milk is bad for you.There are tons of studies that link red meat to breast cancer,lowering your son’s sperm count if you eat it while pregnant,leading to prostate cancer,and tons of other things.Milk is not good,it is always pushed for it’s calcium,yet the calcium in milk isn’t very usable by the body,calcium must be in equal ratio to magnesium,milk has a ration of three to one of calcium and magnesium.Milk is not healthy,it has recently been pushed for weight loss also,which is a complete lie created to promote its product.I don’t see how you can bash soy for estrogen,80-90% of soy grown is fed to animals to be raised for meat,and toxins,bacteria,and ESTROGEN get stored easily in fat tissue,which many cows are fattened quickly and are kept cramped and get no exercise,not to mention animals raised for meat are given REAL hormones to make them grow faster.The brain damage study was done in Hawaii,it was also said that the soy was processed with Alkaline,which was believed to be what caused the brain damage,not soy alone.Alot of the soy propaganda comes from Weston A. Price.
“It is the position of the American Dietetic Association and Dietitians of Canada that appropriately planned vegetarian diets are healthful, nutritionally adequate and provide health benefits in the prevention and treatment of certain diseases.Well-planned vegan and other types of vegetarian diets are appropriate for all stages of the life cycle, including during pregnancy, lactation, infancy, childhood and adolescence. Vegetarian diets offer a number of nutritional benefits, including lower levels of saturated fat, cholesterol, and animal protein as well as higher levels of carbohydrates, fiber, magnesium, potassium, folate, and antioxidants such as vitamins C and E and phytochemicals. Vegetarians have been reported to have lower body mass indices than nonvegetarians, as well as lower rates of death from ischemic heart disease; vegetarians also show lower blood cholesterol levels; lower blood pressure; and lower rates of hypertension, type 2 diabetes, and prostate and colon cancer.”They may also have a lower risk for some other diseases such as constipation, diverticular disease, gallstones and appendicitis. Women who eat little or no meat are four times less likely to develop breast cancer than women who eat meat reguraly.An English study that compared the diets of 6,115 vegetarians and 5,015 meat eaters for 12 years found that the meatless diet yielded a 40 percent lower risk of cancer and a 20 percent lower risk of dying from any cause. According to William Castelli, M.D., director of the famed Framingham Heart Study, vegetarians outlive meat eaters by 3 to 6 years.After reviewing 4,500 scientific studies and papers on the relationship between cancer and lifestyle, a team of 15 scientists sponsored by two leading cancer research institutions advised that those interested in reducing their risk of many types of cancer consume a diet that is mostly fruits, vegetables, cereals and legumes. They declared that up to 40 percent of cancers are preventable, with diet, physical activity and body weight appearing to have a measurable bearing on risk. In 1996 the American Cancer Society released similar guidelines, including the recommendation that red meat be excluded entirely from the diet.Heart disease does not have to be a death sentence or mean a life of cholesterol-lowering drugs and bypass surgery. By prescribing a vegetarian diet, regular exercise and spiritual nourishment for his heart patients, Dean Ornish, M.D., proved that the progression of this number-one killer can be halted and even reversed.In 1995, 683,000 people died prematurely as a result of atherosclerosis-related diseases. In other words, they died largely as a result of their meat-eating ways. This figure represents 29 percent of all deaths for that year.
Meat contains 14 times the amount of pesticides as plant foods, since pesticides get concentrated as they move up through the food chain, and since they’re more easily stored in fatty tissues.The EPA discovered that the breast milk of vegetarian women contained far lower levels of pesticides than that of average Americans. A study reported in the New England Journal of Medicine found that “The highest levels of contamination in the breast milk of the vegetarians was lower than the lowest level of contamination…(in) non-vegetarian women… The mean vegetarian levels were only 1-2% as high as the average levels in the U.S.”In the fall of 1996, a study showed that prenatal exposure to PCBs, even relatively small amounts, can impair intellectual development in children. Aside from fish, PCBs can be found in other high-fat foods such as cheese, butter, beef and pork. Women who plan to become pregnant were also advised by the study to avoid foods containing PCBs because the chemicals can remain in their bodies for years.An early ’90s EPA report found that 95 percent of human exposure to dioxin, a known carcinogen, comes from consuming red meat, fish and dairy products. Later, chicken and eggs were added to the list. Dioxin builds cumulatively in fatty tissue. The only way to flush it out is through rigorous fasting or via lactation. When a batch of dioxin-contaminated soybean feed entered the food chain in 1997, the FDA set limits on concentration at one part per trillion. If all animal foods were held to this standard, it is likely that many would not be cleared for human consumption.
In the United States, farm animals receive 30 times the antibiotics that people do–not so much to treat infection, but to make the animals grow faster on less feed. Though perfectly legal, the practice is, in effect, promoting the selection of antibiotic-resistant bacteria. Some of these bacteria can cause human diseases that physicians are finding difficult to treat. The practice is adding to the general worldwide crisis of drug-resistant disease. Each year, 60,000 Americans die because their medications were ineffective in combating bacterial strains.Every year, on average, each American becomes sick and 9,000 people die from something they ate. That something was probably of animal origin.Except in rare instances, neither the USDA nor the FDA has any regulatory powers on farms where pathogens originate. With the exception of E. coli O157:H7, dangerous bacteria are legally considered “inherent” to raw meat. It’s up to consumers to neutralize pathogens with cooking. Two of the “legal” ones–campylobacter and salmonella–account for 80 percent of illnesses and 75 percent of deaths from meat and poultry. One hamburger can contain the meat of 100 different cows from four different countries. One infected animal can contaminate 16 tons of beef.The Centers for Disease Control estimates that campylobacter infects 70 to 90 percent of all chickens. Campylobacter infections give their human victims cramps, bloody diarrhea and fever and lead to death for up to 800 people in the United States each year. For 1,000 to 2,000 people per year, infection will lead to Guillain-Barré syndrome, a disease that requires intensive care for several weeks. A September 1997 sampling of supermarket chicken in Minnesota found 16 percent infected with an antibiotic-resistant strain of campylobacter.A USDA microbiologist declared in a Time magazine story on processed poultry that “the final product is no different than if you stuck it in the toilet and ate it.” No wonder: A 1978 USDA rule allows poultry processors to wash contaminated birds rather than discard them or cut away affected parts. “Wash,” as interpreted by the poultry industry, means “communal dunk” in what amounts to a virtual fecal soup that ensures salmonella cross-contamination.
Vegetarians have also been shown to have more endurance.At Yale, Professor Irving Fisher designed a series of tests to compare the stamina and strength of meat-eaters against that of vegetarians. He selected men from three groups: meat-eating athletes, vegetarian athletes, and vegetarian sedentary subjects. Fisher reported the results of his study in the Yale Medical Journal. His findings do not seem to lend a great deal of credibility to the popular prejudices that hold meat to be a builder of strength.
“Of the three groups compared, the… flesh-eaters showed far less endurance than the abstainers (vegetarians), even when the latter were leading a sedentary life.”
Overall, the average score of the vegetarians was over double the average score of the meat-eaters, even though half of the vegetarians were sedentary people, while all of the meat-eaters tested were athletes.
A comparable study was done by Dr. J. Ioteyko of the Academie de Medicine of Paris. Dr. Ioteyko compared the endurance of vegetarians and meat-eaters from all walks of life in a variety of tests. The vegetarians averaged two to three times more stamina than the meat-eaters. Even more remarkably, they took only one-fifth the time to recover from exhaustion compared to their meat-eating rivals.
Wherever and whenever tests of this nature have been done, the results have been similar. Doctors in Belgium systematically compared the number of times vegetarians and meat-eaters could squeeze a grip-meter. The vegetarians won handily with an average of 69, whilst the meat-eaters averaged only 38. As in all other studies which have measured muscle recovery time, here, too the vegetarians bounced back from fatigue far more rapidly than did the meat-eaters.
I personally believe that being a vegetarian or vegan is the healthiest way to go, but I also believe that one can eat meat and dairy IN MODERATION and CAN still live a healthy lifestyle. However, the average American eats more junk food and processed food than anything else. Just look at the rising trends in obesity.
Thing is… cow’s milk is made for its babies, just as human breast milk is made for our babies. Cow’s milk contains nutrients and is designed to provide nourishment for its growing calves.
If the deer you hunt could speak, do you think it would say, “Please kill me”? Or if given the chance, would it want to breathe, eat… live?
***As for soy, I’M QUOTING AN ANSWER FROM A FELLOW YAHOO! ANSWERS MEMBER. I think I know who posted it, but I will not say for I am not sure. I saved this person’s answer (and keep a printed copy in my purse for reference!) because it shed some light on what I believe to be common misconceptions about soy milk; I also believe it’s bad propoganda put forth by the very industries who oppose it: the dairy industry.
” It’s strictly dairy and meat industry propaganda you’re reading!!!
First off aluminum has been *cleared* as a causative agent in Alzheimer’s disease!! Victims of Alzheimer’s naturally collect aluminum as a *symptom* of their disease. There might be someone in a commercial environment somewhere using aluminum to cook with but that would be surprising since the metal of choice in ANY food plant is stainless steel! Aluminum wouldn’t survive the rigors of production for long and most industrial sanitizing regimens would rapidly *destroy* aluminum! The person making this claim is a total idiot!!!!
Soy does NOT contain estrogen or any other animal hormone! It *does* contain chemicals called phyto-sterols which are similar to hormones like estrogen but don’t react like hormones in the human body. Animal products like milk or meat DO have REAL animal estrogen and hormones! If you do a little research on steroids and hormones you will learn that all these chemicals have a ‘steroid base’ of four carbon rings (3 six carbon and one 5 carbon ring). VERY minor changes in what and where other atoms attach to this steroid base have VERY different bio-chemical results! If this was a real issue all men would have big breasts from drinking animal milk and eating animal flesh which do have *real* estrogen! I’m still amazed that none of the mega-farms have boomeranged this claim on the dairy/meat industries!! Whats worse? Plant almost hormones or animal real hormones?<EVIL GRIN>
You didn’t mention lectins but there are NO lectins in soy! This is a false claim that some started spreading last summer so I’ll go ahead and nuke it now just in case<g>.
Phytates are another false claim made against soy! *RAW FRESH* soybeans do contain them but these compounds are *very* sensitive to heat and rapidly disintegrate at temps over 135F. When you start talking about processed soy like ‘milk’ or meat alternatives their phytates were destroyed long before processing was completed. Kidney beans are another common ‘source’ of phytates and you don’t hear screaming about them!
A *VERY* tiny percentage of humans have predisposition to thyroid problems and these few people should avoid soy along with lots of other products! There is NO independent peer reviewed science showing that soy can cause problems in folks that are ‘normal’ and there is just as much weak research showing that soy is not a problem for people with thyroid predisposition. If you are a person with a ‘bum’ thyroid avoid soy along with all that other stuff on the list of no-no’s!
Same thing with allergies! Lactose (milk), gluten (wheat), peanuts and strawberries all rank higher than soy as an allergen. IF you are allergic avoid it, otherwise it’s not a problem!!
Look at sales of meat and dairy and you’ll see why this garbage is being spread! Dairy sales have gone from being flat to dropping and soy and other dairy alternatives have skyrocketed. The meat industry is also freaking over the rapid gain analogs (fake meat) is making on their sales. They are the ‘back source’ for all the anti-soy rumors! Look at the sources of the soy is bad research and you find the same researchers and institutions coming up. Almost half of it tracks back to the University of Wisconsin and U. Michigan both of which are heavily dairy funded (cheese heads?).
Farmstar, I *REALLY* wish there was albumin in soy!!! I’ve got a cooking problem that albumin would solve but there isn’t any source of vegetable albumin! Real processed soy is at least as digestible as fermented soy! Go back to your journal and look through the footnotes on your article
Hi there, I’m vegan.
No vegan or vegetarian will look you in the eye and deny that things like animal liver can offer you nutrients such as iron, that milk has calcium, that shellfish has zinc etc
However, if I need these things, I also can get it from a plant-based source. In some cases, many nutrients provided by items such as dark green veg totally outweight their meat/dairy opposition. Even in the cases where the dairy/meat may provide more vitamins than the plant-based source, we should probably all consider this:
1) Has the source come from a factory farm, where the dairy/meat has been contaminated with growth hormones?
2) Has the source come froma factory farm, where the animals may have suffered from internal diseases, or skin diseases?
3) Milk contains thousands of blood and pus cells. Soy, rice and nut milk doesn’t. So, milk may contain more calcium, but then, I could get tonnes more calcium from green vegetables. Also, milk aggravates asthma and food allergies, as well as containing a lot of saturated fat.
4) Meat and dairy are responsible for, I think it’s 95% of all food poisoning. Do I want to take that risk by choosing zinc from shellfish over a pumpkin seed? No.
5) Storage. Has the meat/dairy been stored correctly from A-B? How would you know for a fact that was the case?
6) No one ever got CJD from a carrot.
No one is saying just eating carrots is a good idea. Any sane person will agree that a balanced diet is key to optimal health… however, like I said, the risks for meat/dairy outweigh the positives, so they’re not in my diet.
Lots of people go vegan/vegetarian for health purposes and don’t care about animal rights.